Underpants!!! Thoughts, please?

[magycmyste]

Ok, so in my not-quite-steampunk novel, I have a scene where I have a very handsome pirate interrogating my heroine (no, he's not remotely the love interest), who is essentially dressed in a rather long, loose shirt and presumably, underwear. I just realized I've never actually addressed the issue of underwear in this world, and thought this might be a good time to start.

This world is very loosely based on Victorian times, mostly in terms of technology (with magic) and aesthetics. But not necessarily sharing all the Victorian ideals and prudishness. In general, if women are wearing largish, poofy dresses, would it make sense at all for them to not be wearing giant bloomers under them,and instead wearing more modern style underwear (i.e. tiny)?

More specifically to my heroine, my heroine will probably have tiny underwear anyway, but she's from another country with a more sexually open nature (Most of the modesty she has would probably be more for the benefit of the people she's usually around, not herself). And she was dressed in a men's field uniform (before she got stripped) that traditional Victorian women's undergarments would not fit under. And for some reason, the only pictures I seem to find of men's underwear are long johns which I don't think would work for this. I could just have her not have anything (which might make more sense, if she was wearing the men's underwear, but got stripped of that), but I'm not really trying to eroticize the moment here. The pirate is willing to sexualize her, but he's more interested in making her as uncomfortable as possible.

Thoughts? What works for you when your characters need to cover up the naughty bits?

(Cue Austin Powers' pineapples and coconuts.)

(And it's not a silly scene, but apparently looking up Victorian underwear puts me in a silly mood.)

Comments

[lea_hazel]

I think it's less prudishness and more itchiness, honestly. Nontheless, an Edwardian undergarment might suit your needs better. It's longer than modern butt-covering underpants, but not particularly voluminous. Under the men's uniforms are meant to be particularly tight, I see no reason why it shouldn't fit just fine.

The Wikipedia articles about underwear are really interesting, too.

[magycmyste]

Yes, they are. :)

You mean along the lines of these? http://www.etsy.com/listing/45912655/frillies-edwardian-underthings-chemise

I definitely like the look of those better than what I was seeing for the Victorian undergarments. I'm still leaning towards the heroine's being closer to the modern style, but mostly because of the culturre she's from. But the Edwardian style would probably work much better for the women from Visella, including the female soldiers (She's wearing the men's uniform and pretending to be a man mostly because her friend couldn't sneak her a women's uniform). All of the soldiers' uniforms should probably be close-fitting, but not so tight they couldn't fit the undergarments (no corsets, though, I think).

Thank you!

Thank you!

[paganpaul]

You could also simply add something of your own idea. Perhaps something you yourself would find convenient/comfortable. Someone from another country will sport the fashion from there, perhaps they are quite specific on underwear there. Or they wear none.

[magycmyste]

::nod:: That's what I'm thinking for the heroine, at least. She's been in Visella (the semi-Victorian setting) for a couple of years, so outwardly, I think she'd have adapted to many of their customs, but I think for undergarments, she might stick to Ivrenian style, with little to no coverage). She might have some Visellan-style undergarments to go over that, if she needed to, but I don't see why she would trade in for the Visellan style permanently.

Honestly, I think I'm leaning towards nothing at all. :)

[melannen]

I strongly suspect that neither of your characters are wearing underpants. :D

Modern small, tight underpants is less about reduced prudishness, and more about a)wearing tight clothes that loose ones don't fit under, b) having washing machines that means we can have clean underpants every day, and c) lightweight, highly elastic fabrics that make skintight clothing comfortable and easy to fit.

The main reason the only men's underwear you're finding from that period is long johns is that there was no point in bothering with it if not to keep you warm; too much trouble and discomfort (especially on shipboard!). Your male character probably just tucks the long tails of his shirt around himself to protect his trousers. Your female character, when in skirts, would probably either be wearing no underpants, or bloomers with an open crotch (which is what early women's underpants had; don't want to have to bother taking them off to use the privy); crossdressing, she'd probably either wear nothing or long johns if it's cold (like the men would have), or something improvised to give the impression that she's got a package in her pants.

[magycmyste]

Good points. Now, I'm a little tempted to have one of my other characters invent something to clean clothing and undergarments more easily and thoroughly. It's the kind of thing she'd do, although I don't see that playing into the story enough to really put it in. :)

I think i'm definitely leaning towards nothing at all. It doesn't actually come up for the pirate (yet), but it'd make sense for him not to be wearing anything either - he could follow customs from wherever he wants to, really. I'm still debating a little bit, but I think it makes mores sense that way.

Thank you!

[brigid]

Yeah, this. Underpants are a pretty recent invention. Men's shirts had very long tails for precisely this reason.

[vanessagalore]

try googling "crossdressing of female pirates", I got a bunch of interesting sites

[magycmyste]

Ooh, thank you!